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Backlash: Women Bullying Women at Work
By Ben | May 11, 2009
In an article in the New York Times on May 9, 2009, “Backlash: Women Bullying Women at Work,” Mickey Meece describes numerous cases of women bullying women at work.
Of course, women abuse, harass and sabotage other woman at work, just like men do to each other. Sometimes they’re overt and sometimes they’re stealthy, sneaky. Isn’t that your experience?
More important than distracting questions and considerations about how much they do it, why they do it or do they do it more or differently than men, are:
- Do you recognize the early warning signs of bullies?
- Do you know how to stop them skillfully?
Women often say that other women aren’t as overt about bullying; they’re more likely to be stealth bullies. Some use tactics that are sneaky, manipulative, backstabbing; some form cliques and start rumors or demeaning put-downs; some pretend to be friends and bad mouth you behind your back; some are negative, whining, complaining “professional victims;” some are passive-aggressive. And some can be nit-picking, control-freaks just as much as men.
How about Meryl Streep and other unsavory characters in “The Devil Wears Prada?”
Some are splinters, rotten apples and cancers – at all levels in your organization. Just like men who bully.
As I show in my books and CDs of case studies, “How to Stop Bullies in their Tracks” and “Eliminate the High Cost of Low Attitudes,” bullies are not all the same, but their patterns of behavior, their tactics, are the same – whether they’re men or woman. That’s why we can find ways to stop them.
Ignoring the problem or begging, bribery, appeasement, simply reinforce low attitudes and behavior at all levels. A major part of the problem are conflict-avoidant leaders, managers and co-workers who think that if we all talk nicely to each other or try to make bullies happy, they’ll stop bullying.
If we don’t stop bullies, they’ll think we’re easy prey. Like sharks, they’ll just go after us more.
When women and men learn how to stop bullies in their tracks, we develop strength of character, determination, resilience and skill. We need these qualities to succeed against the real world bullies they face – men or women.
Of course, individual coaching will help you design tactics that fit your specific situation.
Often, the strong and clear voice of an outside consultant and coach can change these behaviors or empower managers and staff to remove these bullies. I’ve often helped companies and even non-profits and government agencies create and maintain behavioral standards (team agreements, ground rules for professional behavior) that promote productivity.
Topics: Coaching, Consulting, Eliminate Low Attitudes CD, Hostile Workplace, Public Speaking, Stop Bullies Book | 21 Comments »
May 19th, 2009 at 11:44 am
Hi Ben;
Thanks for this information. I think women may actually be more skilled and subtle at bullying then men since they may have to bully from a position lower on the workplace hierarchy. One of the reasons bullies thrive is because some managers admire bullies and are bullies themselves. Thanks for your work. (I wrote a response to your comments on my article “Top Ways to Help Start a War”) on my blog at http://www.leonardnolt.blogspot.com
Leonard Nolt
May 28th, 2009 at 2:03 am
Hi Leonard,
Yes, we disagree. And I appreciate the thoughtful response on your blog.
I’d also say that some wars have been necessary because that’s the only way that some people learn. That’s the human condition.
Best wishes,
Ben
October 11th, 2009 at 10:07 am
[...] Notice that these examples were of girls bullying other girls; a common occurrence that often gets lost in the glare of publicity about boys who bully. These are often the girls who will grow up to be women who bully women at work. [...]
December 8th, 2009 at 7:28 am
[...] men also engage in gossip at work, the typical image of harassment and bullying with gossip involves grown up mean girls using the same tactics they perfected in middle and high [...]
January 28th, 2010 at 1:06 pm
Whoever, Ben Leichtling is he should be prasied for his efforts to stop bullying not just in the workplace but in all aspect of bullying. He is right it is the Bully who should be gone!!!!
I ran a bully away and did not realize it until she was gone , this Bully had been my supervisor she often went around asking employee “what do you know ” about so and so. She had done me the same way and after becoming aware of the sites that described the BULLY BEHAVIOR I could recognize the Bully’s tactic the mode of operation they use.
Number 1 bullies are not happy people and they want to destroy other people because they themselves are not happy. What had happened to me I had been working this job as a Nurse and everything was fine I thought , as I said my Supervisor was a Bully she either liked you or she didnt if she did not like you she would go around looking for complaints for other employees to make about you, then she used the issues to fire the person whom she was out to attack.
she had tried to use this tactic with me asking me to watch certain employee’s she did not like. I would not comply, infact I would go to that employee and tell them to be careful and advise them what to correct so she could not fire them.
well in this hard economy jobs can be hard to find and one of the Nurse’s in our comapny had lost her job because she had been placed in a position she was not qualified she is a Lpn and the company had her doing Rcm work and you had to be an Rn to hold that title. One of the Nurse Consultant brought this to the companys attention so that Nurse lost her job and came to seek work at the building I worked in.
My supervisor began to write me up for no reason the same week , because there were no opening to clear a spot, when I realized this was happening for everything she wrote about me I checked it out. Example: she wrote me up for pucnhing in at 6:06 AM my defense was we have a 7min grace period well no we did not it was 5min what happend was I never received an employee handbook so I was not aware of the rules the handbook was giving to me that day, and I signed for it the day of the write up so her little birdy flew out the window.
Next she wrote me up alleging I had incorrectly transcribed a medication order last month and start asking me is everything going on okay in my personal life this raised a red flag with me. So I went to check the record to further investigate the write up. this is what I found out I had never touched the order, she had just wrote me up about, It had been another Nurse I immediatly went to her to tell her to take the write up out of my file her face turned red and she said she would look into it. At the change of shift I told the on coming Nurse about it, because she had transcribed the medication order she looked in the chart found the order and to my surprise nothing was wrong this order was in place.
Problem : as I said the order was in place so why did she write me up and, how had she convinced me in the first place to sign her write up, because the order she showed me had no signature but it appeared to have been tampered with , well we figured it out she had taken the order made a copy then took the order placed the copy over the signature and copied it again to make it appear it had not been signed by anyone. I went to her the next day demanding to see the write up she said she could not find it she knew I was on to her.
she went around asking co-worker about me to see if she could find any complaints . and she did. A co-worker told her I had recently filed a Discrimination Lawsuit she also; said I had also been talking about racism and added slavery too. well this scared the shit out of my supervisor because her motive to fire me was to take my job to make room for this White Nurse I am African American, after she heard about the Lawsuit that next week she resigned.
I feel I sent that Bully out the door by standing up to her and she got scared and quit. I was fired 2 weeks later due to she had infected the new supervisor with what had been said regarding the lawsuit. I am in process of filing a complaint with EEOC and will update you later of the results.
January 29th, 2010 at 1:16 pm
Hi Linda,
Thanks for sharing a terrible and, unfortunately, common type of story.
You did great! Keep on fighting them. Glad you got a good lawyer.
The only other thing that had an outside chance of working at the beginning (not with them, not now) would be to go up the company tree to find a big boss who’s will to shake out the rats. To convince the boss, you make a business case: Bullies cause EEOC suits the company can’t afford. Get rid of bullies and save money. A personally case based on, “It’s wrong or unfair,” usually has less of a chance of being clear or moving most executives.
The good executives or managers would have already created an environment where that bully couldn’t have gotten away with it or been supported by her boss.
Good luck and best wishes,
Ben
March 23rd, 2010 at 7:26 pm
I have been doing research on this topic for the past three years and can not find a CD training video that depicts the subtle and covert bullying of women on women in the workplace, do you have such a training video or know a contact I can inquire.
Thanks
March 24th, 2010 at 12:55 pm
Hi Ajaye,
Sorry, I don’t know of any training videos I can recommend.
I do a lot of consulting and coaching to help women recognize these behaviors in the workplace. And especially, to take effective action to protect themselves, to stop these bullies and to create an environment in which they’ve eliminated the high cost of these low attitudes.
Since you’ve been on the trail for a long time, you’ve already uncovered many books on the subject.
By the way, an email to the address you mentioned bounced back. Sorry.
Best wishes,
Ben
May 17th, 2010 at 9:09 pm
[...] your years in junior and senior high school, and in college? Haven’t you also seen incidents of harassment, bullying and abuse by women against women in the workplace? Ask your daughters what’s happening now in their schools. Are their principals, teachers and [...]
September 8th, 2010 at 3:43 pm
A comment on Linda K from Portland. Linda was never written up for clocking in @ 06:06. Linda was never written up transcription errors. Linda has had a track record of bullying other staff and then tries to play the woe is me card at a letter date. her suprvisor was not aware of any EEOC cliam and or any comments that Linda had made about “about racism and added slavery.” Her supervisor did not resign two weeks later.
I wish people would portray the truth about the facts and not make up any false details based on the un-true.
September 9th, 2010 at 2:48 pm
I HAVE KNOWN AND WORKED WITH LINDA FOR OVER 10 YEARS-SHE SENT THIS TO ME. THIS COMPANY WOULD NOT HONOR THE HOURS STATED-40 HOURS EVENING SHIFTS. LINDA WORKED FOR MONTHS WITH NEVER 40 HOURS -STRUGGLING TO SURVIVE ON 24 MAYBE 32 AND LINDA WAS ALWAYS AVAILABLE. I KNOW LINDA WE TALK EVERY DAY. THE TACTICS THESE COMPANIES PULL APPALLING AND THIS COMAPANY IN PORTLAND NEVER HIRED AGENCY- THE COMPANY HIRED X-TRA LPNS- SO NO ONE HAD FULL TIME. THE TACTICS THESE COMPANIES PULL ON THE AMERICAN WORKER- THE PREDATION OF WORK PLACE BULLYING IS THE MAIN FACTOR IN THE DECLINE OF THE AMERICAN FINANCIAL SURVIVAL- BESIDES THOSE ‘AT WILL LAWS’ AND THE ‘HR TYPES’. ETC. INFLATED REAL ESTATE, ETC.
I HAVE KNOWN LINDA PROFESSIONALLY FOR 10 YEARS- I WAS IMMEDIATELY IMPRESSED BY HER PROFESSIONALITY, HER CLINICAL SKILLS AND HER PERSONAL WARMTH AND EMPATHY. BOB W. WHAT YOU WROTE AS A COMMENT IS NOT THE TRUTH AND BTW I AM OF EUROPEAN CAUCASIAN DESCENT.
September 9th, 2010 at 4:32 pm
9-9-10
Well, this is a nice argument – I wasn’t there and can’t say anything about this specific situation.
In general, companies do have lots of power and can and often do misuse the power. Linda needs a good lawyer who can help her build a case. Not the company lawyer.
And there are individual employees who do bully other staff and even their managers. Sometimes bullies get control by playing, “Poor me, you hurt my feelings, I’ll sue.” I call them “Professional victims.”
They’re described in “Eliminate the High Cost of Low Attitudes.”
I consult a lot in just such situations but I don’t know the truth in this particular situation.
So Linda, keep going after them and you’ll see if you can change them or get compensated. And Bob W., we’ll see what comes out of it.
Best wishes,
Ben
September 9th, 2010 at 4:45 pm
LINDA WAS HIRED TO WORK FULL TIME-THE COMPANY REFUSED TO HONOR IT THEN HIRED SEVERAL OTHER NURSES FT-AT ONE POINT THEY DID ALLOW LINDA 1 MONTH TO WORK FT- THEN TOOK IT BACK TO GIVE TO NEW EMPLOYEES.
September 9th, 2010 at 4:55 pm
This is an interesting dialogue between “Linda,” her friend, and “Bob W.” I have no information about this conflict except what is written on this blog. However this does illustrate the need for anyone who is being bullied to document the behavior of the bully/bullies. That includes keeping a record of the date, time, location, the behavior of the bullies, plus what was said, names of witnesses and their behavior, (witnesses have a tendency to just watch and not actually get involved. They may see it as a form of macabre entertainment), etc. The more details you include the better. If possible it might be wise to secretly record conversations with a small digital recorder. Having a record of what happened is priceless when you report bullying, either to management, legal assistants, or even to the media. However, do not under any circumstance, give or loan your only copy of the bullying record to anyone else.
Good luck.
Leonard Nolt
September 10th, 2010 at 1:06 pm
Hi Ben
I see one of me bullies has come here on Bullies Be Gone. well first I like to let it be known that I cant say I know this guy who calls himself Bob W. it would be great if he or she is going to answer my my post to first be honest enough to use a proper name and stop hidding behind a fake name.
What I shared here at Bullies Be Gone with you is absolutely it appears that this bully calling himself Bob w. had also made a comment on another site as well actually I believe I know who he is, but that not all that important.
Apparently I am talking about 2 different worrplaces the one I speak of here Bob W. never worked there or he/she would know what I was saying is true.
Yes,I experienced all I said here namely when this facility I speak of above Yes when they became aware I’d filed a discrimination lawsuit against my previous employer they FIRED ME. I have a memo to prove this aspect of my story.
Bullying tatics were used at firsr they began making up lies, but I was on top of this tatics so they found a employees who reported to them I had this discrimination case she had heard about it via gossip.
this co-workre was also Black she mention to them i had talked about my previous employer who I am sueing this tey eqauted that I was talking about racism.
It was year 2008 Obama was running for President some co-workers talked about how far this country has comeat time the slavery topic came up this they equated into I was talking about slavery i have it all in writting in a Memo that floated around 3 weeks.
What I want to say is Bob W. whoever you are get your fact right matter fact Bob W. I know who you are I just saw you last week in deposition hearings Sir regarding my case. thank you althought your intentions was to hurt my case Sir you actually helped me you’v had your chance so dont go hunting me down on the internet talk to my Attorney Sir!
Glad you became aware og Bullies Be Gone. and I hope you learn something here Sir # 1 DON’T BE A BULLY WE ARE WORKING TO GET RID OF BOSSES SUCH AS YOU BULLYING IN MY CASE WENT INTO DISCRIMINATION DUE YOU DID NOTHING TO STOP OR PREVENT IT.
YOU WILL REMEMBER LINDA KEITA FOR THE REST OF YOUR LIFE SIR.
September 10th, 2010 at 5:42 pm
Hi Leonard,
Good advice. And check the legality of recording conversations secretly.
Also, I hope people read the article;
Don’t be a Bystander-Spectator; be an Active Witness
http://www.bulliesbegoneblog.com/2010/09/06/dont-be-a-bystander-spectator-be-an-active-witness/
Best wishes,
Ben
September 10th, 2010 at 5:43 pm
Hi Linda,
Your turn Bob W. Put up or shut up.
September 13th, 2010 at 4:13 pm
Fact 1 – Linda was hired for full-time work and offered full-time work.
Fact 2 – Linda refussed full-time work and then complained about being treated unfairly.
Not sure how the above two facts promote or encourage bullying.
September 14th, 2010 at 10:32 am
FACT 1- BOB W-I HAVE KNOWN LINDA FOR 10 YEARS. FACT 2- LINDA IS A WORKER, A TRUE AMERICAN WORKER AND YOU KNOW THAT.
FACT 3- LINDA WAS HIRED FOR FULL TIME WORK BUT NEVER GIVEN A FULL TIME SCHEDULE.
September 14th, 2010 at 1:59 pm
Bob W say that fact 1 “Linda was hired for full-time work and offered fulltime work” .
Linda Keita says: I applied for full-time work and was hired to work full-time, however my employer would not allow me to work full-time they hired several white nurses and place them full time at one point this employer placed me full-time for 1 month and then they hired another white nurse they placed me part-time giving that nurse full-time with hours I worked, after serveral conversations and letters they still refuse to honor the position for full-time once I complained to higher authority they immediately began to retaliate with write up after write up the same month they ran a newspaper Ad advertising fro the same position on the shift I worked they recommended that I be terminated.
Bob W says: Fact 2 ” Linda refussed full-time and complain about being treated unfairly” .
Linda says : They offered to honor my full-time after I complained to corporate I agreed to take another shift verbally , and 2 hours later they wrote me up ~in the write up was the offer for full-time~. They were trying to trick me into signing a write up, they were going to cover their tracks by mentioning this supposed new offer when I refused to sign the document they withdrew the offer for full-time 4 months later they rec’d a complaint from EEOC in where I was immeadiately terminated they did treat me unfairly infact they treated me illegally wrong.
Bloggers @ BBG: This Bob W. is insane he’s coming here to Bully be Gone because he was chased off another site running after me on the internet. This Bob W. is a Bully he gone a far a to try to get me to engage in an argument here @ Bullies Be Gone , because the fight is not over yet they are losing this case because in this case Bullying turned into discrimination and I had proof the behaviors found in bullies linear into discrimination same tatics except they bullied me because I was African-American and I refuse to go away.
Bob W. be a man except your mistakes and move on you did not do the right thing when you had a chance you failed too late I tried to help you sir , another thing Bob W. these are 2 seperate issues of course I did not work with you @ the above mentioned facility, if later I was terminated for filing a case against where you use to work as they fired you for not being able to do your job, anyway sir you have a nice day take care but be aware Bullies will be Gone unless you can come here without your Ranting and Raving Lying and Cheating dont ever say anything to me again Also ~ take Ben’s advice let’s see where this ends you have a blessed day ~
September 15th, 2010 at 10:25 am
Hi Linda and Seattle Nurse and Bob W.
I think it’s time to end this private fight on the blog.
I hope readers got a sense of what happens when these fights go on and:
1. Why managers need to know what’s legal before they do anything so they know what they can and cannot do, and they also how to do legally and properly what they think is best for their company and team.
2. Why we need to get the law involved to settle disputes.
3. Why you need to learn what documentation you need and how to get it and how to keep it – whether you’re management or an employee.
4. Why good, objective labor lawyers are necessary on both sides of the equation.
Best wishes,
Ben